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Concerns Rune System Not Changing (NA/EU)

  • This is the 2nd part to my Bless Concerns video:


    Summary: Gear scaling becomes an issue after a couple months of progression, and then TTK gets absurdly low transforming into a 1 shot fest. Problem is we haven't gotten a clear answer on if this will be changed or not for NA/EU.


    Cause:

    There was a transformation from Original Bless KR to Bless Rebuild in JP and KR.

    • In old Bless there were hard limitations on Runes: I.E. you can only slot certain Runes on certain armor types.
    • This made stat customization through gear kind of stale, but it kept power growth in check.
    • In Bless JP the hard limits were removed. Now as long as you get a Rune that matches the Rune Slot on your Item you can slot anything you want on every armor piece. This means eventually through grind you can get all gear with the exact rune slots you want.
    • Also in Original Bless you could only get your gear to +10, and the stats gained through upgrading were modest.
    • On JP you can now upgrade to +15, and at 15 you get an extra Rune Slot on your gear "Awakening".

    So not only did they remove hard limits, but they also introduced an extra slot to each piece of gear through +15 or Awakening. This means with even more grind and even more RNG madness, you can start with a piece of gear with desired Rune Slot. Then as you upgrade and RNJesus blesses you, when you Awaken your item you can get another Power based Rune slot.


    In the new system:

    • No more hard limits, already more access to Power based Runes.
    • Now extra Rune Slots, so even more access to Power based Runes.
    • BIG ISSUE: It seems that they never adjusted the Scaling Ratios on Abilities. So scaling is same as in old system when power was significantly more scarce.
    • Also, stats like Crit, Haste, and Defensive stats give such little return that they cannot keep pace. "Classes like Ranger have access to crit from their own crit., but crit. through gear is abysmal.

    Consequence :

    Pure Attack Power and Ability Power blow everything else out the water. Damage Numbers are through the roof, healing is high too. However, it doesn't matter since HP is rather low, and defensive stats are weak as well.

    At Fresh 45, and even when you have the best in slot gear TTK is rather healthy. Once people get optimal runes it starts to decline. Once people Awaken their items it becomes absurd and devolves into 1 shot fest.


    Perspective:

    • Fresh 45 might have 450-700 ATP/AP
    • Semi-Geared 900-1200
    • Optimized Rune Slots 1600+
    • Awakened 2-3k
    • Awakened plus RNJesus Procs 3k+ "Rumored upward of 4k."

    Possible Solutions :

    • Adjust scaling ratios across the board.
    • Shave power off of every Rune.
    • Make it so that your 2nd Rune in gear only gives secondary stat.
    • Increase/Incentivize secondary stats.
    • Raise defensive stats.
  • Great video and more important than gameplay combat !!!


    It's so simple to divide "attack" runes by 2 or 3 ... boost "defense" runes


    Or add a hardcap like so many others mmo ... like at around 1500 spellpower, adding more spellpower give you nothing ... so u will need to take defensive runes too when u reach the hardcap


    The weapon in Bless give u only ~10% to your attack potential ... all came for runes ...


    Same like you for the absurd buffgroup ... it's like the epic leech cook


    Or and there is some others shits recently, but we don't really play anymore on JP !!

    On the Tower dungeon (3 mens), u can obtain bracelet

    These bracelet could be legendary too, until +15

    There are some bracelet which give you +30% leech on hit

    Last time I saw a mage soloing Patala ruin with a +13 bracelet leech (= +23%) ... without use any potion, 0 (he has 1900 spellpower)


    WTF why u add these kind of items in your game ???????????


    I join u for that they don't really know their game, they don't play it


    Just for information, except if they nerfed them but epic runes are +93 Spellpower if I remember well

  • Thank you! I honestly would like to see a soft cap. Either that or just adjust scaling ratios and shave power. Then take things like Haste and give it a bump up, and give crit a slight bump as well.


    Yeah even your armor gave you very little of your actual attack potential.


    That bracelet is insane!!!


    Yeah I asked someone still playing as I didn't want to spout something like 90+ and be wrong, would rather be wrong lowballing it then exaggerating it. And the person told me +72, oh well haha. +93 is just ridiculous.

  • Very nice video! All tho now I am quite concerned about this =O

    BIG ISSUE: It seems that they never adjusted the Scaling Ratios on Abilities. So scaling is same as in old system when power was significantly more scarce.

    I hope they fix this :/

  • Izkimar Nice insight! Just for the curiosity - is there known how the actual (JP/KR) damage formula is? Or it has some shady and/or complicated mechanics and nobody is able to test and deduct the calculation due tons of factors involved in it?

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  • /sigh, they are redoing the rune system for NA because of the 1-3 shot fest caused by the existing rune system. They answered this question at the emissary event....

  • One thing to note that this stuff is from 6-8 months after the game has been released in Japan. Let's take time to level and enjoy the game before we worry about huge endgame implications. We will eventually get there but let them focus on getting the BASE game finished. Yes, we will need this system updated/changed, but do we need it day 1?

    There are many ways to help fix the problem, but the issue is finding a "best" way so it fits well into the community and not hurt their budget (aka long/extra development time). The OP gave some examples as to how to change the system and I'm sure we could all find positive and do-able ways to fix the system. I just want the game to feel like Bless at first before it goes on a huge makeover. Most MMOs evolve and change but we are asking for them to make all these changes in short time. I've learned that doesn't happen.

    I too fear for this power creep from hell, but I'm hopeful that by the time the majority of players get to this point we have come up with a idea/plan to address it. I think this video was great, informative, and needed. Please think about the path we have to take to get to a fix before we all get bent out of shape about "end-game".

  • Rela Thank you! Me too!


    Hya Thanks, no tbh I don't personally know of anyone who knows the formula. Also on our combat log in JP/KR the translation didn't tell us which skill was doing what dmg.


    Rime again before you try to sound condescending as stated here and in the video, they gave a very vague response. In the most detailed response we heard they just said they are adjusting it, think they have it ironed out, and the most we heard was something about no stacking. Which could mean a lot of things. There are multiple no stacking situations that wouldn't even fix the problem.


    Solracs this stuff affected JP much sooner than 6 months in. I think the crazy power spikes probably started to happen about 2 months into the server's lifespan. Also, changes to the rune system wouldn't make the game not feel like Bless. There are easy number fixes that wouldn't even change the actual system. Anyways, good points, I want to enjoy the game too!

  • Let's say they fix the stacking issue. Like the OP said, they maybe put it back to certain pieces only have X Y Z slots available. Would making runes a % and scale to your level of skills? This would put emphasis on leveling skills more than runes, much like they have hinted to.

    What ideas do we have to at least attempt to address the looming issue?

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  • Let's say they fix the stacking issue. Like the OP said, they maybe put it back to certain pieces only have X Y Z slots available. Would making runes a % and scale to your level of skills? This would put emphasis on leveling skills more than runes, much like they have hinted to.

    What ideas do we have to at least attempt to address the looming issue?

    They would have to scale it. There probably is some element of level balancing in the game, especially if they plan to allow higher levels to go into the lower level dungeons. FFXIV does it so the precedent for such a system already exists, they just need to implement it in Bless.

  • "Redoing it" isn't really an answer and disguised by a band-aid. The emphasis on character progression could be similar to BDOs skill point system. Bless' version seems like you put points into skills to buff them individually. BDO didn't have "buffed" versions but I am just using a comparison.

    In BDO people's progression was based on level and skill points. Higher you are the more options; easy. Options after that for change in power was from enhance levels on gear. Bless has this too, so there still will be a difference in power from gear alone. Then you look at crystals from BDO, and that they were limited to CERTAIN pieces. This method allows for some customization without creating a creep towards 1 scaling stat. It does create "cookie-cutter" like builds, but I'm ok with that over the 2 shot alternative. Bless, at least in the version we are able to get our hands on now has a "we are working on it" rune system.

    That means that maybe on day 1 they don't quite get to it there is the potential to see some of the people that have JP experience to hit this power curve early and ride the easy train for awhile. SO....we are just having a conversation to see what possible avenues there are to avoid, change, or build from the rune system we know we "could" get. Care to share?

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